HP “talk” (spoilers in comments)

In this post we will use the comments section to “discuss” HP7.  If you have not read the book and do not wish to see anything – do NOT click on the comments.

I repeat. Do NOT click on comments if you do NOT want to read any spoilers.

However, for those of you that have read the book and have musings, questions, observations, requests, etc please apparate to the comments section and let’s discuss.


25 thoughts on “HP “talk” (spoilers in comments)

  1. First thoughts…I enjoyed it. I really was involved and invested for 80% of it. I LOVED the magical objects introduced such as Hermione’s giant Marry Poppins style magic purse, and the history of the invisibility cloak. My gripes: Harry seemed kind of annoying some times. Moody and secretive and horribly unforgiving (hated the bit with him & Lupin and how much he resented Albus not sharing his entire life with him). But the worst bit for me was the epilogue. I hate, hate that Harry ends up with Ginny & that Ron ends up with Hermione. It seemed too perfect. Too tidy. Did we need things to be so tied up?

    What did you guys think?

  2. That didn’t bother me too much, since the bottom line for me is that this is supposed to be a kids’/all ages book and I would have been really pissed if it went all grown-up complicated/sophisticated ending. If he had really died, I would have thrown all my books away for real. Someone speculated that she could write more books based on their kids and it does seem like maybe that was left open as a possibility (why stop at a trillion dollars when you can have two trillion!?).
    I agree that he was annoying, but I thought it was pretty realistic as to what teenaged boys are like! My biggest gripe was that the whole middle was much too long and I was bored during the long chapters of very little happening (in the tent endlessly trying to figure out what to do). I haven’t agreed that all of her books were too long, but this one really was, in my opinion. In all fairness, I wasn’t 9 months pregnant when reading the others, but I actually fell asleep every time I tried to read the whole middle third. Frustrating.

  3. Yes, that middle section just seemed to D.R.A.G. on for me. The deal with Tonks & Lupin, was too quick and not fitting for them, especially Lupin.

    She really ticked me off with the whole Hagrid-nearly-dying-twice stuff. But otherwise, it was a fitting end to the series. Not my favorite, and probably not the best. But fitting. Like Return of the Jedi. Fills in the spots, concludes the story. But not the best.

  4. I agree with Bri about Harry’s annoyingness. SUCH the teenaged boy. I really wanted to smack him sometimes and I actually thought that was a really smart move: I mean, really, he was being set up as a martyr hero and it would have been insufferable if he hadn’t also been a teenage prick at the same time.

    I also thought that the scene with Lupin was pretty spot on. Here is Harry whose biggest gripe and complaint this entire series has been his lack of parents and how his father was stolen from him, and here is Lupin, at this point the closest thing Harry has as a father-figure (not nearly as close to Lupin as to Serius, but right up there as his father’s sole-surviving friend) and there Lupin is trying to run out on his kid. How else would Harry react?

    I know that other people have also hated the epilogue, but I liked it, too. It finished the loose ends of that particular story, but it doesn’t really end Harry’s story. Even in the epilogue he’s still only in his late 30’s… as I get closer and closer to my late 30’s I realize how much of my life and growing-up I still have to do.

    I do agree with Bri, though, that keeping to the whole a book takes a whole year thing left a LOT of that middle section as fairly redundant and monotonous. I mean, I can kinda see the point of having them sitting around confused as to the correct course of action… I mean, these are KIDS who were given oblique clues and a huge dose of paranoia, but come ON!

  5. That’s been my complaint about Harry since book 5. He’s such a teenager. All that angst is very difficult to handle.

    I also understood Harry’s reaction to Lupin and agree with Trista that there wasn’t any other way for him to behave. Also, I think his point was to be so miserable and obnoxious about it that he drove Lupin back to Tonks….which is what happened.

  6. Ditto on the teen boy behavior. And I agree that Harry was right to say what he did to Lupin. I think deep down Lupin agreed with Harry–he was just terrified and trying to avoid facing up to a scary situation.

    I liked that Harry and Ron ended up with Ginny and Hermione. She’s been dropping clues about those particular pairings since Book 1; I would have been disappointed if she had done anything else.

    I CAN NOT BELIEVE no one has mentioned the whole Snape thing!!

  7. I knew Snape was good and that the whole Dumbledore thing was planned. I thought it was to stop Draco from being a killer but the backstory in #7 made the whole thing so much more clear.

    I love the scene where Snape died and gave his memories to Harry. It explained so much about Snape’s behaviour over the years. Everytime he saw Harry he saw Lily’s eyes in her son, who looked just like his father….Snape’s enemy. Unrequited love sucks big time but actually makes sense in this story. I loved when he said “look at me” and then he died…. Throughout every book they’ve always commented on how Harry had Lily’s eyes. And I just thought it was fitting that Snape wanted Lily’s eyes to be the last thing he saw.

  8. i absolutely LOVED this book. every single part of it (well, except for hedwig dying in the beginning) i loved the whole back story on snape and that he had been in love with Lily all his life. and how his motive was always his love for her, but it was also always wrapped up in his envy/animousity towards James. it was stunned to realize just how torturous it was for him to be around Harry, with James’ looks and the eyes of his love.

    i LOVED that Harry & Ginny ended up together. mainly because he loved her so much, but pushed her away to keep her safe, that was such an honourable thing to do – so it was good to know in the end that he got to be with his love. and ron & hermione. lordy. all i have to say is its about damn time! hehehe.

    *shrug* i think i must be some kind of freak, and am seriously hesitating even hitting *post comment* at this point… i thought this book was perfection.

  9. I really liked this book — thought it was a good ending. Can someone explain how Neville ended up with the sword of Gryffindor (sp?) at the end when he killed the snake? I thought the goblin took it when they were at Gringots. I must have skipped over that part, because I was confused…hope this doesn’t sound like a dumb question!

  10. I loved the book! But I did have one gripe – I wish Ginny would have played a bigger role in the final story. I know that Harry, Ron, and Hermione are the central characters, but just would have loved to have seen Ginny emerge from the background in this book. I also thought perhaps the epilogue was a way of leaving things open for future books based on the next generation. And I’m puzzled about Neville and the sword too. Oh, and that weird baby thing when Harry was talking to Dumbledore – that was just strange! I’m not sure I buy Ron and Hermione happily ever after – those two just never seemed right for each other to me. I do love how Snape’s memories filled in so many of the blanks.

  11. oh! So glad someone brought up the Snape stuff. Really- that might have been my favorite part- his gifting of his memories to Harry. Getting to know his backstory was So rewarding. I want to go back and read Snape sections from earlier books now.

    And yes- VERY good question about the sword- how did it get back to Hogwarts?

    I finally watched a Dateline special I had recorded with JK and she said something that helped me “get” the characters more. She explained that as she was developing each character one the defining traits was how that character felt about death.

  12. During times of need, the sorting hat has the power to produce the Sword of Gryffindor for people who represent the true spirit of Gryffindor. It did this once for Harry, so that he could kill the basilisk and save Ginny in Chamber of Secrets. Both the sword and the hat originally belonged to Gryffindor (the guy) who founded Gryffindor (the house). Now I feel like that worst episode ever guy on The Simpsons.

    I really enjoyed reading the book. I think the word I would use to sum up the experience is “satisfying.” It wasn’t perfect—I thought that the text needed some reigning in and tightening in places (like all the stuff in the woods with the tent; a little less of that would have still gotten the point across). I also thought she relied too much on long stretches of exposition/plot dump; to use a creative writing class cliché, she was telling, not showing. I agree with you about the epilogue, but I think that she put that in mostly to keep anyone from trying to publish new Harry Potter stories (without her) that veer off wildly from her intentions. I am not sure I agree with Harry’s final assessment of Snape—I mean, obviously, what he did must have taken enormous courage and strength, but I still don’t think he is a great man, since if it hadn’t been for his love for Lilly, he would have been a Death Eater and let Harry die without a second thought. In the end, Snape seemed to me like the perpetually stunted teenager while Harry finally got to grow up. But I was very happy with the book as a whole.

  13. I was touched that Harry named his son after Snape. I knew, grudgingly, that everyone was right that he would be good in the end. I always disliked him, but now I feel terribly sorry for him. He was entirely alone.

    I liked the epilogue, but not in a literary way, just in a greedy way. I want more more more. And I wanted to be sure Teddy was okay, that Harry had taken care of him.

  14. I was touched that Harry named his son after Snape. I knew, grudgingly, that everyone was right that he would be good in the end. I always disliked him, but now I feel terribly sorry for him. He was entirely alone.

    I liked the epilogue, but not in a literary way, just in a greedy way. I want more more more. And I wanted to be sure Teddy was okay, that Harry had taken care of him.

    I do have a question…at one point Harry (through his Voldemort connection) sees Draco doing something horrible and is upset at “the use to which Draco was being put.” But we never find out what that was. Is it just supposed to suggest that Draco is having a bad time of it??

  15. I really loved it, too. I think it was my favorite of the whole series, but I thought that after reading every one!!! And I agree with Joanna… that Snape seemed like a stunted teenager… like he never grew up and got past his own heartache. It did add more depth to him, tho, and redeemed him a bit in my eyes… at least, it made him seem more like a human. And the first thing I thought when I read the 19 years later ending (complete with kids off to Hogwarts) that she was leaving room to continue the series with a whole fresh set of kids, and not just anyone’s kids, but Harry’s and the whole gang. Man, let’s all get together and come up with an idea for a book series… young adult literature is really where it’s at. Let’s put this M.F.A. in Creative Writing I got to use, girls….

  16. There’s a link in my HP post that gave more of an epilogue. Its password protected “fairy lights”. WIth the space.

  17. I, too, thought it was…what’s the word?…cool?…that Snape wanted to look at Lily’s eyes via Harry one last time as he died. Nice touch, and a reflection of what Snape had the potential to be. What a sad, pitiful man he was. Someone mentioned that he would have been nothing but a Death Eater if it hadn’t been for his desire to protect Lily’s son, but I think that’s what made him brave. He abandoned the only group of people who ever remotely accepted him in order to protect a kid he resented with every fiber of his being. It would have been so easy to go over to the other side and say, “Well, the woman I love is gone so fuck her kid.” But he didn’t, so I think that’s why Harry admired him in the end.

  18. I absolutely loved HP7, although I wholeheartedly agree that some of the mid-section could have been trimmed a bit. Like Cali, I loved Hermione’s purse; I giggled while reading about it (like the dork I am) because it was basically a Bag of Holding (bag with infinite capacity, ignoring/negating mass & weight) from Dungeons & Dragons. TOLD you I was a dork.

    I actually liked Harry’s teenaged angst and jerkiness. At 17/18 years old, his actions and reactions are going to be, or at least SHOULD be, different from those of a preteen. As most of us know from TTC, hormones make you crazy. 😉 And teenaged boys/young men aren’t exactly known for being universally tactful, sensitive creatures, and I think JKR portrayed that well.

    The resolution: Well, of course Harry was going to survive. I mean, despite the thoughts and theories of a lot of the adults who love the books, these books are first and foremost a children’s/young adult series, and you just don’t kill off the hero at the end of a kid’s storybook. It Just Isn’t Done.

    The Epilogue: Storywise, I think it was necessary considering the audience. With thousands of pages devoted to these characters, JK would have been lynched if she’d just written, “And Voldemort was dead, and there you go. The End.” There was a need, a hunger, to know what happened next, and those 3-4 pages were sort of a sliver of cheesecake to round out the meal. Not enough to really fill you up, but you at least got a taste.

    What’s next: I’m really sitting on the fence on this one. The sensitive side of me thinks that JK’s epilogue was saying “that’s it, that’s the end, you know they lived happily ever after. It’s over, let’s all move on now, shall we?” Buuuut…. the practical/cynical/business side of me thinks that it was an incredibly shrewd move, leaving an opening– hell, not just an opening, but even setting up the characters– for a new series. Which of course, hardcore fans would buy. Heck, JK could write a series about the early life of Filch, and people would buy it! 😉

    Sorry for the book-length response, Cali!

  19. JKR says, in interviews, that she’s not writing a new series (we’ll see) but that her next project is a Harry Potter Encyclopedia. I’m not clear on what that means. But as Kim accurately points out…I’ll probably buy it.

  20. I loved the whole Snape thing..throughout the entire series, I wasn’t sure if Snape was really bad or secretly good. One of my favorite parts in the book is when Draco’s Mother asks Harry if Draco is still alive and then lies to Voldemort..I think it just showed that Mother’s love conquers all. I’m sad that the series is over..I think I sobbed the most when Dobby died and when Lupin and Tonks died..I had to keep rereading to make sure that I read correctly that they BOTH died.
    Did anyone see the interview with JK Rowling telling everything that happened after the book? It was nice and tied things up. Victorie that Lupin’s son was dating is Bill and Fleur’s daughter.

  21. I JUST finished…maybe this discussion is long dead and no one will read my comments…but just in case, hear goes:

    I agree with the description “satisfying”. I knew that Harry wouldn’t really “DIE” although i was never quite sure what form his body and soul were going to take in the end (i almost for a bit imagined some weird “after-life” kind of thing like in the last Narnia book but i’m glad he got to live in the usual sense of the word).

    As for the slow middle, i found myself enjoying that because i knew that once i got to the end it was just that, the END…and that felt sad to me. Even if there is another series or whatever, this is the end of this one and i wanted it to go on for awhile.

    Although it was horribly sad to me, Tonks and Lupin dying fighting Voldemort and leaving their son behind was symbolic/metaphorical, don’t you think? Just like Harry himself, in a way? Maybe the next series will be “Ted Lupin and…” dunno; doesn’t have the same ring to it.

    I wouldn’t say that i think Snape turned out “good”…just not as evil as he was portrayed. He was a great example of how we can’t always judge a person’s insides and motives by their behaviour and it was a perfect ending to bring Snape’s childhood feelings and experiences around at the end.

    Yeah, it was a little too perfect at the end…but as someone pointed out it’s a story mainly for children and it was necessary to wrap it all up and say “that’s really it, folks, don’t go looking for more”. There’s no more Voldemort, no more scar pain (does that mean no more evil in the world??) and Harry’s not a kid anymore. Personally, i think a series with the kids would be stretching it and just too much of a good thing (like when you have a few bits of fabulous chocolate mocha cake and decide to order up another but you’re really so full that it just doesn’t taste very good…you eat it anyway because it was so good the first time…but end up just feeling sick and hating it). Sorry, someone else used a dessert analogy and, well, being a dessert lover i had to run with it. As it was, it ended like a perfect meal–happily full but not sickingly stuffed.

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